Having bunch of plugins built-in is not any better than having a bunch of plugins
Having a bunch of plugins built-in means also supported in updates and play nice with each other
I would argue it’s worse. You can’t choose the things that are actually beneficial to you and how you work.
You guys use editors? Real programmers only need a mechanical hard drive, a magnetized needle and a steady hand.
Like a code tattoo.
neovim users spending 3 days rewriting old unmaintained extension for telescope
quietly scoots his entire github repo for his neovim configuration and 200+ plugins behind his back
Haha yeah totally
What on earth do you need/use 200+ plugins for? Can you name a tenth of the uses off-hand? 😅
A lot of them are dependencies of other plugins.
Stuff like icons support, and every little feature. Neovim is extremely minimalist to start, so you need plugins just to get something as simple as a scrollbar lol
Things like git status of files and file lines, all your LSPs, syntax highlighting (for each language you work with), file explorer, you name it, there’s a lot.
But what’s nice about nvim is for any of these given features, there’s numerous options to pick from. Theres probably a dozen options to choose from for what kind of scrollbar you want in your editor, as an example.
So you end up with a huge amount of plugins in the end, for all your custom stuff you have configured.
You have to setup yourself (though theres a lot of very solid copy pasteable recipes for each feature):
- Scrollbar
- Tabs(if you want em)
- bookmarking
- every LSP
- treesitter
- navigation (possibly multiple of them, I use both a file tree, telescope, and harpoon)
- file history stuff
- git integrations, including integrating it with the numerous other plugins you use (many of them can integrate with git for stuff like status icons)
- Code commenting/uncommenting
- Code comment tags (IE TODO/BUG/HACK/etc)
- your package manager is also a package (I like lazy for wicked fast open speeds, neovim opens in under 1s for me)
- hotkey management (I like to use
which-key) - prose plugins (lots of great options here too, I use nvim for more than just coding!)
- neorg, so I can use nvim for taking notes, scheduling stuff, etc too
- debugger via
nvim-dap - debugger UI via
nvim-dap-ui - lualine, which is a popular statusline plugin people like to have at the bottom of their IDE for general file info
new-file-templatewhich lets me create templates for new files by extension (IE when I make a.csfile and start editting it, I can pick from numerous templates I’ve made to start from, same for .ts, .lua, etc etc)- git conflict, which can detect and work with detected git merge conflict sections in any type of file and give me hotkeys to do stuff like pick A / B / Both / Neither, that sorta stuff
The list goes on and on haha
Helix crew
Reporting in! 🫡
Being plugin based avoids bloat (doesn’t matter for code-oss because it’s electron)
It also plays into their goal to make VS Code seem open source while being the opposite! A lot of the functionality is in the marketplace but non Microsoft products aren’t legally allowed to use it and you’re not allowed to distribute builds of the plugins.
Use VS Codium instead.
You are allowed wtf. If the plugin author didn’t distribute it elsewhere, it’s on them. MS doesn’t forbid them from uploading the extension build elsewhere, they just wanted their marketplace not getting requests from not-their-client which is a fair point for a for profit company.
You are allowed wtf.
No. If you’re using something other than Visual Studio Code you have to manually download plugins and the MS specific ones use licenses like this.
https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items/ms-vscode.cpptools/license
SCOPE OF LICENSE. The software is licensed, not sold. This agreement only gives you some rights to use the software. Microsoft reserves all other rights. For clarification Microsoft, or its licensors, retains ownership of all aspects of the software. Unless applicable law gives you more rights despite this limitation, you may use the software only as expressly permitted in this agreement. In doing so, you must comply with any technical limitations in the software that only allow you to use it in certain ways. For example, if Microsoft technically limits or disables extensibility for the software, you may not extend the software by, among other things, loading or injecting into the software any non-Microsoft add-ins, macros, or packages; modifying the software registry settings; or adding features or functionality equivalent to that found in Microsoft products and services. You may not: a) work around any technical limitations in the software that only allow you to use it in certain ways; b) reverse engineer, decompile or disassemble the software, or otherwise attempt to derive the source code for the software, except and to the extent required by third party licensing terms governing use of certain open source components that may be included in the software; c) remove, minimize, block, or modify any notices of Microsoft or its suppliers in the software; d) use the software in any way that is against the law or to create or propagate malware; or e) share, publish, distribute, or lease the software (except for any distributable code, subject to the terms above), provide the software as a stand-alone offering for others to use, or transfer the software or this agreement to any third party.
Look at the usages of “In-Scope Products and Services” in Visual Studio Marketplace’s Terms of Service. https://cdn.vsassets.io/v/M253_20250303.9/_content/Microsoft-Visual-Studio-Marketplace-Terms-of-Use.pdf
Then specify MS plugins. If you only said plugins on MS marketplace, you are blaming MS for things they didn’t do
It also plays into [Microsoft’s] goal to make VS Code seem open source while being the opposite! A lot of the functionality is in the marketplace but non Microsoft products aren’t legally allowed to use it and you’re not allowed to distribute builds of the plugins.
My use of “their” may have been too ambiguous. I thought it was clear from the context that I was talking about Microsoft’s program, marketplace, and plugins specifically. When you use VS Code with things like C it’s like “hey, download this extension!” So from your perspective that’s a thing VS Code can do, because it’s so seamless and easy to add in. But what you don’t realize is that you’re downloading a proprietary, closed source extension. When you use VS Codium you can’t (easily) get those extensions (without breaking Microsoft’s terms of service). It’s the same shit that Oracle pulls with their JDK distribution and a big part of why OpenJDK usage is much more common post 2019ish.
Yes, hence why I commented that MS never prohibits you from publishing your extension elsewhere. Nor does MS forbid you from using other marketplaces when using their product. It’s like saying valve is prohibiting game dev from publishing their game elsewhere or distributing their game outside of steam. It’s just not true. And MS has all the right to limit their marketplace to their own client too. After all, it is first and foremost, their service for their product specifically. It’s like you’re making an unofficial client for youtube.
I never said MS is doing any of those things. I even linked their TOS to show you very clearly what they’re doing and not doing.
And MS has all the right to limit their marketplace to their own client too. After all, it is first and foremost, their service for their product specifically. It’s like you’re making an unofficial client for youtube.
I never said they shouldn’t “have the right”, I said they’re open-washing. They act like VS Code is open source but the build they distribute is not and a lot of the functionality they add in through recommended plugins are both not open source and you’re not allowed to easily download them from other plugins. Everything about VS Code is fauxpen source to the max.
describing IntelliJ as “good”.
Shots fired back. 😈
If you want everything bundled instead of à la carte, that sounds more like eclipse to me. But then, I don’t understand how anyone can program in Java.
Lol “as good as intellij” what the actual fuck.
I cannot imagine how much worse you’d have to make vscode to make it as shit as intellij is. And even vscode is pretty shit.
Kotlin would be a great language if it wasn’t hampered by that IDE.
NGL I’d use jetbrainz products more if they weren’t that pricey and more portable
Most of their IDEs you can use for free for non-commercial purposes and even if you need to buy them; when you compare software development to any other profession our tools are incredibly cheap. You can get all the Jetbrains IDEs for less than 300€. Compare that to a HDL simulator or a 3D CAD application like Autodesk. These easily cost several thousand euros each year.
Same. I use VSCode at work, because we need some of the features that are premium in Jetbrains products and the licenses are too expensive for my company.
If your work can’t afford less than $20/seat/month for business-critical software, I’d start looking for a new job because your paychecks are about to dry up, anyway.
Is it business critical if it can be done elsewhere for cheaper/free?
Yeah, that’s the reasoning they have. It works with VSCode. Ish.
Funny how such companies don’t care that employees would be more effective with better tools and those license prices would result in way over $20/month profit. 🤷♂️
Lol wow, intelliJ? Shit’s slow as fuck
Eh… No?
You prefer to focus on its other shortcomings?
VSCode is just Emacs with a weirder Lisp. (/s)
(You can tear my Emacs from my cold dead hands)
No need. Looking at the age of users of emacs vs others we’ll live a long time
That’s mostly because using inferior software causes stress and stress is unhealthy.
Yes, I’d rather have 35 different IDEs for every task I need to do. Much better than One To Rule Them All.
You mean one to struggle to rule them all?
i feel like the odd one out whenever i tell people i dont want the shitty ide launcher for jetbrains products on my computer. i havent used their products because of that launcher.
They work without it though
You don’t seem great at taking decisions
Intello sense still won’t find the Godot classes :-/ (linux & C#)
What about Rider?
Is that a plugin?
It’s a separate Jetbrains IDE for .Net
Thanks! Jetbrains rock.
